What kind of lighting effects are people looking for?

Madman Lighting · Post by **Madman Lighting** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:57 am

Hi All,

While I work away on current projects, I'm wondering what people might like to see from Madman Lighting.

I see that Delux-8s continue to sell and much to my surprise, BIG Starship kits have sold fairly well.

How can I serve you, my customers, better?

Richard Baker · Post by **Richard Baker** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:35 pm

I voted for the wireless transfer (induction?)- In particular I would love a nit which could be built into a stand and a smaller/cheap reciever that could be installed in several models so I could light something by just putting it on the stand, swapping as I felt like it. I have to rotate my models on display and having let say a fighter/hanger base where I could place a viper/X-Wing/whatever and have it light any one that has a reciever installed. Having an expensive pair matched would not be as perfect a solution but good.

While I did not vote for 'other' one wish would be a multi channel 'flutter' driver- like the tea candles people were chopping up for the Y-Wing engines. Having a quick flutter with several LED channels would be great for capital ship engine lights or is you used different colored LEDs you could do some cool UFOs like in CE3K.

.

photoguy · Post by **photoguy** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:41 pm

There was a discussion about this kind of thing a few weeks back. What about some simple single effect circuit kits. Add-ons that could be incorporated into larger projects.
1. A simple strobe for navigational beacons
2. Photon torpedo launcher effect
3. Fade up/down (or orange-blue) navigational deflector
4. Clock driven room lighting - different lights turn on and off over a period of time (minutes? hours?)
5. Warning lights (flashing yellow or red) accompanied by a flickering/flashing/sparking effect to simulate battle damage
6. Chaser board with tiny LEDs that could be used for hanger bay landing lights

Those are the ones off the top of my head. I've gotten pretty good with the basics,(steady lights, and various flashing 555 circuits) but these would represent the next level for my lighting skills. If they were offered as simple to build DIY kits, then your customers to learn a LOT as they go!

Kylwell · Post by **Kylwell** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 12:58 pm

Sparks. Intermittent power loss. Power fluctuation.

Basically, sharp random light flickers to random ramp up/ramp down lighting.

That'd do it for me. Even better if I didn't have to know how to program a chip.

rpauly · Post by **rpauly** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 2:34 pm

Chasers and sequencers would be lovely for us dummies that have a hard time getting the + and - ends of the battery right...

Pat Amaral · Post by **Pat Amaral** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 3:02 pm

Richard Baker wrote:I voted for the wireless transfer (induction?)- In particular I would love a nit which could be built into a stand and a smaller/cheap reciever that could be installed in several models so I could light something by just putting it on the stand, swapping as I felt like it. I have to rotate my models on display and having let say a fighter/hanger base where I could place a viper/X-Wing/whatever and have it light any one that has a reciever installed. Having an expensive pair matched would not be as perfect a solution but good.

.

I was thinking of a potentially cheaper solution that might work without using the induction idea. Simple contacts (maybe using tiny magnets) in the base and matching contacts in the various models. You'd only need two (one for + and one for -) in the base and two in each model (maybe mounted in the bottom of a landing gear pad/wheel). No more trying to find a descrete place to hide the ugly plug/socket in the model. The base contacts can be easily disguised as part of the base itself (tie down padeyes on the deck perhaps). This would also do away with the need for a power switch. Want to turn out the lights? Just reposition the model on the base.

These guys have some products that might do the job without having to create them ourselves.

Aside from that, I'd like to see a more modular approach to the kits so people can mix and match features that they need. The Big Starship Lighting kit goes a long way toward this but it would be nice to have some kind of "a la carte" type selection so features could be expanded for particular projects.

Also, a selection of wall warts and battery boxes would be nice. I know you and I have talked about this before, John, and I understand your point about cost effectivity. However, I still think it would be nice if you could provide some power supply choices to go with your kits so people wouldn't have to try to find them elsewhere.

Richard Baker · Post by **Richard Baker** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 3:30 pm

That technique is how I am lighting my Timeslip TOS Galactica. I am runningtwo brass bits to the underside of the engines which will matchup with two points in therear support base for power.
What I was refering to withth efighter dispaly is having a base which supplies power to anything on top of it- you can have a ship in it landing gear (whcich would change from ship to ship) and it would still be lighted.
Other ships I use a stereo phonoplug and jack to provide power and act as a mount- the jack opening is easy to bury in th egreebly. It would be nice to have one base act as lightign support for about seven models to display on rotation.

5. Warning lights (flashing yellow or red) accompanied by a flickering/flashing/sparking effect to simulate battle damage

I really do like the idea of a 'damage' lighting unit to give the flickering fire effect from inside a broken hull- I have seen some custome effects like that and think it would be great to be able to do soomething off the shelf.

.

tetsujin · Post by **tetsujin** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 7:53 pm

Richard Baker wrote:I voted for the wireless transfer (induction?)

How's that gonna work exactly, anyway?

Induction would normally have to be over a very short distance anyway, right? In that case is it still a better option than just having a wire, or a battery (rechargeable or replaceable) inside the model?

PetarB · Post by **PetarB** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 8:51 pm

'Ultimate' Finemold Falcon Lighting kit. Balok made an excellent one for the engines, which he's not offering anymore, unfortunately. But a really good engine one, and other nav lights would be right up my alley. I've seen one using a lightstrip for the engine, but it didn't seem to have the intensity as all the LEDs Balok used.

jwrjr · Post by **jwrjr** » Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:35 pm

I have made all of the ones that Photoguy mentioned except for the landing bay chaser (which would be easy if somebody wanted one).

Shizman · Post by **Shizman** » Mon Feb 09, 2009 4:29 pm

I strongly agree with something that is modular. Perhaps a central lighting system, like your Deluxe-8 and then be able to add various items that do things like photon torpedoes, etc.

Each modular item can be used on its own, but linked to the other modules allows it to be even more impressive.

Then you could have a package deal for your items but also sell them individually of course.

Also, having use cases on your site would be nice and would likely drive sales up. For example, here's where item_x is used successfully, including pictures, etc. Having us look for an article in some magazine isn't the way. You should host the article yourself.

Madman Lighting · Post by **Madman Lighting** » Mon Feb 09, 2009 7:49 pm

Wow, I should be careful what I wish for!

OK, sounds like the thing that nobody is doing yet is the damaged ship lighting kit. Good idea.

Pat: I like those magnetic contacts! I may add them to a kit sometime soon. They look pretty easy to use and not too expensive.

A modular system sounds like a good idea. Believe it or not, I'm mostly there now. All my kits are versions of the same circuit card and they all run off the same 12V DC power. That means I can make effects kits that already work with everything else.

Supplying battery boxes and/or wall transformers is tough, mainly for cost reasons. Competing with surplus houses and Radio Shack isnt easy.

And now the big question: How am I gonna get power thru the air?
I am not saying! I have a plan, and I have ideas. More than that, no way dude.

Now how about this idea: a magnetic "wand" to push the control button on the flasher board. This would work via Hall Effect sensor mounted somewhere just under the model's skin. This would give the user the ability to trigger nifty effects or change sequencing. This is just an idea...

tetsujin · Post by **tetsujin** » Mon Feb 09, 2009 10:51 pm

Madman Lighting wrote: And now the big question: How am I gonna get power thru the air?
I am not saying! I have a plan, and I have ideas. More than that, no way dude.

Knowing, at least in broad terms, the limitations of the approach you intend to use would have a huge impact on what people would be able to do with it and therefore how useful it would be...

Madman Lighting · Post by **Madman Lighting** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:07 pm

OK, good point.

My goal is to be able to transmit about 6 watts a distance of a few feet. The idea is to create a "remote power source" or "remote battery" for powering light loads with 9 or 12V.

This would power 3 or 4 of my cards so with one reciever, you could light your "Battle Damaged Refit Enterprise" with a Big Starship Kit plus a Damaged Starship Kit. You'd be able to lift it off the stand a few feet and show your friends. Or, you could light your X-Wing, Y-Wing, and your Tie Fighter all from one transmitter if they were close together.

For now, cheeseburgers are calling!

Richard Baker · Post by **Richard Baker** » Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:17 pm

I like where you are going with that- I think it would work well with my uses, depending on costs of course.

.

tetsujin · Post by **tetsujin** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 5:18 pm

Wouldn't it be simpler to, for instance:

1: Put a rechargeable battery inside the model
2: Put a power connector where the base meets the model
3: When the model's on the base, power the model externally and recharge the batteries - and when the model's off, run from the batteries?

That would be plenty for taking the model off to show your friends... And the power source would be a lot more stable...

'Course I'm very curious about how you intend to transmit the power...

Richard Baker · Post by **Richard Baker** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:39 pm

Rechargable batteries have to be replaced after time- that would be rather difficult with them built in.
Inducting power is spreading- there are devices for recharging your cellphone/PDA/iPod things by just placing them on a tabletop. Those are recharging batteries, but the power transfer is the same.
I either build the power connection into the support or place a jsck in th egreebly. Inducted power would be a great boon to some displays where the model is suspended on monofilament or a landing bay where all the ships, no matter what position they are in, get powered.

YEA!

.

Madman Lighting · Post by **Madman Lighting** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:22 am

Well, you're right about magnetics being involved for the power transfer but more than that I'd rather not say. What I'm trying to do is tricky and still in concept/design stage.

Of course, there's alternatives to rechargeable batteries. Supercaps have made huge strides lately. Its now possible to get 100 FARADS (yes, FARADS not microFarads) in a D-cell sized package. One of those, plus some of Pat A's magnetic contacts, would be a good way to charge up a something and then float it around a while. I think some of the tiny RC flying toys work this way.

-John

Marco Scheloske · Post by **Marco Scheloske** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 8:54 am

Kylwell wrote:Sparks. Intermittent power loss. Power fluctuation.

Basically, sharp random light flickers to random ramp up/ramp down lighting.

That'd do it for me. Even better if I didn't have to know how to program a chip.

Copy that. Would be cool for battle damage light effects...

Madman Lighting · Post by **Madman Lighting** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:28 pm

OK, good. Thats another vote for the Damaged Starship Kit.

Here's what I have so far:

Star Destroyer/Republic Cruiser lighting kit
Damaged Starship kit
Wireless power kit

I was going to finish and release a rotating bussard collector kit but nobody has shown any interest in that. It would have worked for the 18" TOS enterprise and the big 1/350th NX-01 with a different pattern for each one but, if nobody wants it, then thats that.

-John

starmanmm · Post by **starmanmm** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 9:36 pm

I really do like the idea of a 'damage' lighting unit to give the flickering fire effect from inside a broken hull- I have seen some custome effects like that and think it would be great to be able to do soomething off the shelf.

Gotta go with that.... the rest has been done to death.

jwrjr · Post by **jwrjr** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 11:51 pm

Check out the battle damage in the "Starship Exeter" movie (internet only). The lighting is my creation.

NNYGamer · Post by **NNYGamer** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:21 am

Kylwell wrote:Sparks. Intermittent power loss. Power fluctuation.

Basically, sharp random light flickers to random ramp up/ramp down lighting.

That'd do it for me. Even better if I didn't have to know how to program a chip.

I'm going to use the LEDs from some votive candles I picked up at Big Lots, 4 for $3 and the chip is right in the LED. They should give a nice random energy flicker. Only place I've herd of a spark like effect was for a welding effect for a trains.

starmanmm · Post by **starmanmm** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:39 am

jwrjr wrote

Check out the battle damage in the "Starship Exeter" movie (internet only). The lighting is my creation.

And if I recall correctly... I too have purchased such a lighting kit from you!

Madman Lighting · Post by **Madman Lighting** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 10:31 am

How about this for a Damaged Ship Kit?

4-8 LEDs in Red, Orange, Yellow and Blue, all are 3mm size for compactness
4 feet of fiber optic cable

LEDs flash, strobe, flicker and generally emulate sparks, fires, flickering lights, etc.

Press the control button to select from a couple of different flicker/spark/discharge patterns.

Runs off the same power as all other Madman products and is intended as an accessory to other kits. Keep it simple.

Costs about $55?

Sound good?

rpauly · Post by **rpauly** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 11:10 am

I like.

BTW, John, you have a PM...

Pat Amaral · Post by **Pat Amaral** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 11:21 am

That sounds great, John!

Richard Baker · Post by **Richard Baker** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 11:23 am

I like it!

.

tetsujin · Post by **tetsujin** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:00 pm

Kylwell wrote:Sparks. Intermittent power loss. Power fluctuation.

Basically, sharp random light flickers to random ramp up/ramp down lighting.

Random anything would probably make a good product - Personally I don't know how to make any kind of random-looking effect without using a microcontroller.

Of course, I'm always happy to throw microcontrollers at my own problems, so... :D

Pat Amaral · Post by **Pat Amaral** » Fri Feb 20, 2009 12:16 pm

A few years ago, FSM printed an article where a guy hacked one of those little am radios (the kind you get for free a a promotional item) to have the earphone output drive a red LED. He used it to light a campfire in a diorama. I don't remember all the details but, at the time, the idea seemed like a solid way to get a truly random flickering effect.

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What kind of lighting effects are people looking for?