Alright, shopping for a new airbrush...

Saoi · Post by **Saoi** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 9:30 pm

Like the title says, I'm in the market for a new airbrush. Gone over the posts in here, perused other threads, shopped around, and I think I've narrowed it to a few choices: the Paasche VL, Badger 155, Badger 360. I'm looking for some feedback/advice, hopefully from folks who have tried all three (I know, it's a bit subjective choosing an airbrush).

What I'm looking for in an airbrush:

-Idiot-proof. Or at the very least, idiot-resistant. I'm really, really, really good at the idiot part.
-Cost. I'm really wanting to keep it near the $110-120CDN-ish mark. I also would rather not spend a fortune on replacement bits'n'bobs. Ergo no Sotar for me. Teflon seals also make me happy. It looks like the badgers have 'em, but not sure about the VL.
-Sprayline. Definitely looking for something that can spray a thin line to something good for area-coverage. Not looking to paint eyeball veins on my 1/72 pilot figures, but not looking to paint my car a new colour either. I probably don't need to go much smaller than 1/16" or much bigger than 1" spray line-wise.
-Blindingly easy to tear down, clean, and reassemble. Like I said, idiot-resistant.
-Something that is good for an AB beginner, but that can still serve me well as I get more experienced.

From my reading, it seems like the VL might be a bad idea as there seems to be a consensus that it's rather finicky about spraying paint through it (ie it likes a thinner mixture, clogs easily, etc). But it also looks like fairly simple construction (remember, shooting for idiot-resistant here).
The 360 essentially looks like the 155 but with an adjustable feed (so's I can go siphon-feed, gravity-feed, or sideways-feed if I'm in a gangsta mood).

Essentially, why is the 360 worth the extra dough over, say, the 155 which seems like exactly the same AB but siphon-only? Why the big kerfuffle over being able to adjust my feed? And is the VL as nightmarish as some folks make out?

One of the art supply stores in town also carries the Paasche H and the Aztek 430. The couple of posts I've seen regarding Azteks have been somewhet... critical, to put it politely. Should I be staying away from Azteks entirely? And I don't know much about the Paasche H, anyone have any insights?

karim · Post by **karim** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 9:38 pm

Don't bother with an Aztek. total waste of money.

I've had a VL for a while, and I did like it... it was my workhorse. I've replaced it with a Badger 100. So far, I do like the 100.

The VL is a bit finniky... but I think that may be normal for siphon feeds. I like gravity feeds better.

Post by **TER-OR** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 9:55 pm

There are a lot of threads about airbrushes on this forum.

The Badger 360 is the 155 with a rotating head. You use gravity feed for finer detail work, so you can shoot a thinner paint mixture at lower pressure. Or, if you have only a small amount of paint to shoot you can use less with the gravity feed.

The Iwata eclipse and Omni 3000 have very similar performance envelopes, both will do slightly finer detail than the Anthem/360 - theoretically....

I don't like the Paashe brushes, I find them very heavy and thick.

Romulan Spy · Post by **Romulan Spy** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 9:58 pm

I also have a gravity-fed Badger 100. It sprays fine lines and broad coverage with the medium tip, and it's easy to clean. This is the brush I tend to use most often; the small built-in paint cup is ideal for when you only need to spray small amounts of paint, and there are no bottles to clean.

The Paasche H (available as a set with fine, medium, and heavy tips) is an excellent do-everything brush, though you probably won't be able to spray super-fine lines with it. I use an H with heavy tip to spray undiluted Future. The fine tip works well with thin paint for adding shading and weathering.

Kylwell · Post by **Kylwell** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 10:14 pm

Unless Paasche has changed thier toon, the VL does not have teflon O rings. The 360 is a beautiful brush. The Iwata Eclipse is quite nice and puts up with my ham handed use with nary a burp.

Thomas E. Johnson · Post by **Thomas E. Johnson** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 9:21 am

I have an Aztec 87777 (the A470 with metel body) and I love it. Best airbrush I ever used.

woozle · Post by **woozle** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 9:56 am

I was shopping with the same criteria a couple years ago and my Badger-155 is PERFECT. It's dual action, which means that you press down for the air flow and pull back for the amount of paint. I set the needle so that when I press down, it makes a pencil-thin line and for more, I pull back. I can't controll the air-flow yet so I just have a regulator to keep it at 18-20 psi.

I see that Rossjr is trying to unload one right now:
http://starshipmodeler.net/cgi-bin/phpB ... highlight=

Saturn · Post by **Saturn** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 10:56 am

Saoi wrote:The couple of posts I've seen regarding Azteks have been somewhet... critical, to put it politely. Should I be staying away from Azteks entirely?

Azteks usually elicit a strong love it/hate it response. Some have achieved great results with their brushes; and some have received constant headaches. My five years with the Model Master Pro (now Aztek) was about half-and-half; it perfoms well but was ultimately undependable. I was on my second refurb replacement (a lifetime warranty they no longer honor IIRC) when I switched to an Iwata Eclipse BS five years ago.

I haven't thrown out/sold the old brush. I still keep it around for Future/dullcoat usage. Azteks are mind-numbingly easy to clean, and thats it's greatest strength. Azteks would be a decent choice for a younger/juvenile modeler to cut his teeth on to learn double-action technique and AB cleanliness. But most adult modelers will be found wanting something more precise, IMO.

Thomas E. Johnson · Post by **Thomas E. Johnson** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 11:17 am

It must be the individuals techeiqe. I have tried other airbrushes, and my Aztec is the best and most user friendly I've ever used. I will never switch to another brand or model.

mightymax · Post by **mightymax** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 10:42 pm

Romulan Spy wrote: The Paasche H (available as a set with fine, medium, and heavy tips) is an excellent do-everything brush, though you probably won't be able to spray super-fine lines with it. I use an H with heavy tip to spray undiluted Future. The fine tip works well with thin paint for adding shading and weathering.

You say you are looking for something easy and idiot proof but something you can use as a beginner but still use in the future.

I have several Ab's some double some single action. I learned on a Paasche H and my dad bought me one when I was 18 for architecture class. Now I still use that same H, 27 years later for 95% of what I do! The only reason I use any other brush 5% of the time is simply because I was foolish enough to try to replace my venerable H. I have to use those expensive toys sometimes, right?
Anyway the H is so easy to strip down and reassemble. As a side note I have a VL and the first time I tore it down I had to have it reassembled by a guy in my model club. I did something where the trigger and needle were not linked!
Spraying a fine line is subjective. You can spray a fine line with an H if you know how to use it. Just because an AB is double action and expensive doesn't mean squat if you don't know how to use it!

Cheers,
Max Bryant

SGluedMyFingers · Post by **SGluedMyFingers** » Tue Jun 06, 2006 12:28 am

I have just recently begun using an AB myself, so my input is what it is. For what it's worth, I bought a Paasche VL and have played with it for about a year now. As my first airbrush, I found disassembly/assembly quite easy with the instructions (only had to use them once) and I like the wide grip of the VL. However I have had clogging problems. This may well be attributed to beginner errors on multiple levels. I've had a fair amount of trouble getting Mr. Surfacer through it - but again, beginner errors. I also ruined a needle and tip pretty quickly playing with the line adjustment wheel, so be careful with that. A pressure regulator and heavier thinning has solved a lot of my problems.

In retrospect, I wish that I had gotten something gravity fed with a closed top. The little gravity feed cup that comes with the VL is still siphon fed. You can use a small amount of paint, but still need enough pressure to pull it up. And I'd like more freedom when I'm using the cup - always afraid I'm going to spill it.

Overall, I like my VL. But I do plan to buy a second AB before it's over. I was told it was an excellent AB to learn on so I went with that. I have found it very easy to clean, but it seems that I do it a lot. That may just be part of the game...

Just my $0.02.

Styrofoam_Guy · Post by **Styrofoam_Guy** » Tue Jun 06, 2006 12:52 am

First Airbrush - Badger 200 - hated the clean up time. gave it away

Second Airbrush - Pasche H- Single action external. Easy to learn and easy to clean. I now use it only 5% of the time for large areas

Third Airbrush - Aztek - Double action internal. Very quick cleanup which I love. I use it 95% of the time. I love it. It does clog up every so often as others have experienced but I have learned how to thoroughly clean it up to get it working again.

Fourth Airbrush - Tamiya HG - got it at a great price but I have not tried it yet.

An airbrush is very personal as you can see by the responses. Some hate the lightness of the Aztek while others hate the weight of the Pasche

What ever you are conmfortabl with is your best airbrush.

Alex
Styrofoam Guy

darth_daniel · Post by **darth_daniel** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 3:42 am

Hello to all airbrush experts

,
IÂ´m looking to get a Badger 360-7 Universal and wanted to ask if itÂ´s worth the money. Also, has anyone got a good pic showing the adapter for the air hose? Any maybe a diameter? I have to know if it fits to my compressor.
Also any reviews of this particular airbrush would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for any help!

Post by **TER-OR** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 6:13 pm

I never use the jars. Well, almost never - if there's something like pearl powders which need to be susupended by shaking while I paint, I will use the jar. Otherwise, A color cup is more than big enough for my uses. I'd skip the set and just buy the brush.

The Iwata Eclipse is a similar brush to the 155 - as far as performance goes.

k-dog · Post by **k-dog** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 9:45 pm

post deleted

Neb · Post by **Neb** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 12:16 am

Used a Paasche VL for 10 years and simply thought I sucked at airbrushing.

Then I bought an Iwata, and learned in my first session that you can actually control your airbrush.

$\:D/$

You shoulda seen what I did to that VL...it involved a vise in my garage...

Stubbs · Post by **Stubbs** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 9:04 am

Don't purchase an Aztek. Pure crap. The lifetime warranty is great, I just don't like sending it out every few months.

k-dog · Post by **k-dog** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 12:56 pm

post deleted

DasPhule · Post by **DasPhule** » Tue Aug 08, 2006 2:52 pm

There's really no reason to lay out why it's crap, the fact is that Aztecs are crap. No line control, inconsistent spray patterns, constantly breaking and having to be sent back, clogging of the tips, too light of a body, etc, etc, etc. Several hundred comments about it being a POS is pretty conclusive. Use a real airbrush, and I mean learn to use it correctly, and you too will see that Aztecs are toys compared to the real thing.

Opinions, as usual, are plentiful. Most disagree with yours on this subject. Can it be that you might just be wrong on this one? Ever tried another brand of airbrush? Regardless of your opinion, I HAVE used almost every brand of AB out there, and I can tell everyone, with much experience, that Aztecs are junk. Garbage. Crap. POS. Toys.

Don't troll in here.

Erin
<*>

Post by **TER-OR** » Thu Aug 10, 2006 8:10 pm

An airbrush is a tool, and as is the case with most tools - buy the best one you can afford. There are few guys out there who have used as many different airbrushes as Erin - and few who see less need for diplomacy. There's no reason to finesse your opinion.

In the Airbrush Survey thread you can see peoples' comments.

For my money, a very flexible double action, all-metal, easily broken-down brush is the only choice. That's why I reccomend the Badger 155/360 and the Iwata Eclipse. They're similar brushes as far as performance goes, but the Iwata may have higher quality parts.

Thomas E. Johnson · Post by **Thomas E. Johnson** » Fri Aug 11, 2006 5:02 pm

I use an Aztec 7778 and its the finest airbrush I ever used, and I get perfect results with it. So I do not share the opinion that Aztecs are crap the least bit.

nkuzmik · Post by **nkuzmik** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:28 pm

Can someone help me understand the virtues and vices of gravity feed, side feed and siphon feed?

At the moment, I do mostly gundam models so it looks to me that siphon feeds will end up washing a lot of paint down the sink.

Kylwell · Post by **Kylwell** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:34 pm

nkuzmik wrote:Can someone help me understand the virtues and vices of gravity feed, side feed and siphon feed?

At the moment, I do mostly gundam models so it looks to me that siphon feeds will end up washing a lot of paint down the sink.

Siphon feeds require higher pressure and therefor tend to paint a wider line. They can be more difficult to clean due to the extra plumbing. You can make a paint jar adapter to directly feed from a paint jar.

Gravity feeds can use very little pressure and makes it easier to draw a fine line. Due to the lack of plumbing they are a breeze to clean.

nkuzmik · Post by **nkuzmik** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:55 pm

Kylwell wrote:
nkuzmik wrote:Can someone help me understand the virtues and vices of gravity feed, side feed and siphon feed?

At the moment, I do mostly gundam models so it looks to me that siphon feeds will end up washing a lot of paint down the sink.
Siphon feeds require higher pressure and therefor tend to paint a wider line. They can be more difficult to clean due to the extra plumbing. You can make a paint jar adapter to directly feed from a paint jar.

Gravity feeds can use very little pressure and makes it easier to draw a fine line. Due to the lack of plumbing they are a breeze to clean.

By plumbing, I presume you mean the tube from the bottom of the jar up into the body of the brush?

Kylwell · Post by **Kylwell** » Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:00 pm

Yes. It collects paint, can be aggravating to clean and is worse when the paint jar slips out leaving you with a nice Jackson Pollock camouflage.

nkuzmik · Post by **nkuzmik** » Wed Jun 22, 2011 12:38 pm

Kylwell wrote:Yes. It collects paint, can be aggravating to clean and is worse when the paint jar slips out leaving you with a nice Jackson Pollock camouflage.

Heck, I don't need no fancy air brush to do that!

So what are your thoughts on the Badger 360.

As I mentioned, I'll be doing Gundam models, but I don't anticipate doing anything too difficult. There will be priming and painting of parts on trees as well as on the built model.

Kylwell · Post by **Kylwell** » Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:31 pm

I've heard good things about the 360, I'm an Iwata fan myself.

nkuzmik · Post by **nkuzmik** » Wed Jun 22, 2011 2:10 pm

Kylwell wrote:I've heard good things about the 360, I'm an Iwata fan myself.

So something like an eclipse SBS seems the most flexible. I have no air brushing experience to speak of but I also would rather not buy something I'm likely to out grow.

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Alright, shopping for a new airbrush...

Alright, shopping for a new airbrush...

Re: Alright, shopping for a new airbrush...

Paasche H Babeee!!!!!