Airbrush shopping is such a headache

Liquid Electron · Post by **Liquid Electron** » Sat Aug 03, 2013 9:47 pm

Weeks of reading and watching YouTube vids on various airbrushes and compressors have left my head spinning. You see things like:

'Iwata is the best thing ever', followed directly by 'My Iwata burst into flames and killed my cat when I took it out of the box.' (I'm paraphrasing.)

Then you see these 'Master' Iwata ripoffs all over the place with people talking about them, ranging from 'fantastic' to 'the compressor almost burned my house down' and then to 'I'll never use anything else' to 'the needle fired out of the front when I pressed the trigger'.

Then you read about the ones Testor owns, I suddenly can't even remember what they are. Same range of reviews.

So far, the most consistent one seems to be Badgers. I seem to be drawn to the Patriot, of which I read it is easy to find replacement parts (if you ever need them), it's good for a beginner (which is me), and best of all, a lifetime warranty. It might not be the best at fine lines. I've been staring at Trek kits wondering where the fine lines are that it wouldn't be able to do.

Then there's the world of compressors, ranging from ones with tanks, without, with moisture traps, without, with regulators, without. To giant CO2 tanks, to enormous nail gun compressors. I got a chuckle out of the Badger attachment for tires. Until I realized it actually works. I figure, if I pick up a Badger Patriot, I might as well pick up a Badger compressor (leaning toward the TC908 Aspire)...which of course, I hear Badger doesn't actually make them, but they check them over and brand them. That's fine with me. I just need something for model kits, obviously, not doing any automotive detailing or fingernail art in the near (or ever) future.

Even though I'm leaning towards these things (when I can afford them), my head is still spinning, wondering if this is all in error. I suppose I'm not really asking any questions, I'm just ranting about how ridiculous it is to pick one out. I'm not the type of person with the income to purchase a 'bad' airbrush and just go pick another one up. I have to get it right the first time.

Argh!

Joseph C. Brown · Post by **Joseph C. Brown** » Sat Aug 03, 2013 10:52 pm

Any airbrush artist-types in your area? Tee-shirts, fellow modelers, heck, local fairs/fleamarkets? Find someone who is actually *using* their airbrushes, and ask questions.

What do they like & not like? Take notes. How long have they been using what they are using? What do they like their airbrush? What do they hate about their airbrush? What would they buy if they had to get a new one within the next week?

I trust alot of the gang here when it comes to airbrush opinions, but our personal tastes and budgets vary wildly from person to another.

Myself, I use a cheap Aztec for area coverage painting, and an Anthem for most of my other painting. I had gotten an awesome Sotar 20/20, used it a few times, and then traded it to Dasphule for some resin kits. Just me, but I couldn't keep a tool I wasn't going to be using all that much compared to the other older brushes.

A number of fellow modelers have been singing the praises about the Grex airbrush, and, if they are still happy next Spring, I might look into one. Everyone will be different about their favorite airbrush -- and everything I just said about airbrushes applies even more to compressors.

Liquid Electron · Post by **Liquid Electron** » Sun Aug 04, 2013 12:08 am

The wildly varying part is where the headache comes from. I'm sure I'll be happy with what I get.

Joseph Osborn · Post by **Joseph Osborn** » Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:00 am

You know how awesome a plain old off-the shelf Stratocaster can sound when played by someone who knows how to play it? And how utterly horrible the very same instrument can sound when a ham-handed goofball gets hold of it?

It's the same with airbrushes. Stick with a major brand-- so you can get replacement parts-- and practice.

Post by **TER-OR** » Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:21 pm

The Airbrush Survey here is a good resource for you. No hyperbole or selling - just honest opinions on some standard questions. That's why I initiated it years ago.
http://www.starshipmodeler.net/talk/vie ... php?t=4204

Joseph's right - Get a quality brush - at least mid-range - from any of the big boys - Iwata, Badger, Grex, Paashe - and you'll do fine. We all have our preferences.

For example, spend the extra bucks to buy an Eclipse rather than the Revolution - they're MUCH easier to clean. The newer Badger Renegade are better than their Vega and Badger ancestors, though I do have a soft spot for the Omni 4000...it's just so inexpensive to rebuild.

Post by **TER-OR** » Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:28 pm

I'll tell you what I use:

Badger's Omni 4000 (replaces a siphon-feed 3000). The old Vega Omni line are built well, inexpensive to maintain and very easy to use and clean. I'm thinking of relegating it to metallics since it's a pain to clean the other brushes.

Iwata Revolution. Works OK, a real pain to clean because you can't pull the needle from the front. Bad design, you inevitably pull paint through the body. This will likely be relegated to base coats or given away.

Iwata Eclipse. Just got this, it will be my workhorse henceforth.

Iwata Hi-Line - super detail brush, freakin' sweet. Not frequently used, but indispensable.

Badger Sotar 20/20. Not used anymore. Works fine, but the open cup and a loose adjustment system make this less than convenient.

Compressor is a Testors model I got for a great price.

Targallian · Post by **Targallian** » Wed Aug 07, 2013 6:56 pm

I have a Badger Patriot I never use. I was thinking about selling it recently, and when I pulled it of the box and dropped it and the needle tip bent. (Yes, the tip sticks out that far. Which also prevents you from back flushing to clean it without stabbing yourself.) I checked with the 2 hobby stores in my area, they seem to be able to get any Badger part EXCEPT the needle for a Patriot 105. So, I checked online, and shipping cost more than the needle. It's not a bad brush though, but I need something more versatile.

I also got a Badger compressor that had some problems shortly after I got it. Badger took care of it at no expense (said one of the seals was bad when I got it). Great customer service, but the compressor still seems a little wonky.

I also have an Iwata Eclipse HP-CS, which is a good airbrush, but it just didn't work well for me.

I got a Grex system with the Tritium-TG and compressor, and I love it. It just really works for me, feels comfortable, and is extremely versatile. I can easily do fine figure work and paint a car body with it. Much more expensive than the Patriot, but worth it, I think.

It's really hard to find an airbrush that works for you. The Badger and Iwata are fine brushes, I just never felt comfortable with them. If at all possible, maybe at a show or through friends, try out a few brushes then decide.

Kylwell · Post by **Kylwell** » Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:55 pm

I've never had issues needing to pull the needle out the front. If your seals are good, you shouldn't get any paint from the needle. I get more paint in the rear of the brush from spills than from needle residue.

Anyways... Long time Iwata user. So thee you go.

Compressors on the other hand, I've had my Badger compressor for 20 some years w/o failure. Only once have I ran it hard enough that I tripped the thermal shut-off. That was an hour + worth of spraying.

Honestly, picking between high end brushes, it's a toss up. I love my Iwata and like the fact that I can spend more time painting than cleaning. Shoot some cleaner through it, clean the nozzle and I'm done.

eeun · Post by **eeun** » Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:16 am

I've got a Paasche H (single), a Badger Crescendo 175 (double), and a Veda 130E ($20 ebay el cheapo double-action).
They're all fine. The Paasche is better for larger areas and has interchangable tips. It's okay for detail, but the other two beat it. The Crescendo would get my vote as the best all-round brush of the three. The Veda is best for details, but is rumoured to be somewhat fragile. So far it's been fine for me. It's also around $20 on ebay, so you could buy a bunch as backups.
My only issue has been with the Crescendo's paint cup, which has a bad habit of falling out when full of paint.

I use a hardware store compressor with a built-in 5-gal tank. Fill it, shut off the power, and I've got silent airbrushing until the tank needs filling again. Usually one tankfull is enough to get me through a session. Also, unlike my tankless compressor, I've never had any problems with moisture in the line.

Del · Post by **Del** » Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:34 pm

I'm gonna second the hardware compressors, and you can get them anywhere from $50 to $100 for a decent size. I recently switched from my silent tankless model compressor to a 2 gallon hardware compressor and love the difference. I may step up to one that can handle higher pressure and with a larger tank though, mainly so I have one I can use for other household tasks.

ignatz · Post by **ignatz** » Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:05 pm

No point getting overwhelmed with the choices. But you have to jump in with both feet, keep an open mind and be prepared to shift gears if you have to. I think there's a fair amount of trial and error involved, mixed with a significant amount of subjective bias. You can look are reviews, articles and brochures until the cows come home. You can invest hundreds of hours into research, talking to people, exploring options, etc. Then you finally make your decision, buy the AB of your dreams, and then over the course of a few hours or few days, discover all the stuff you hate about it.

Do the due diligence, put in some reasonable amount of research, and grab the AB and compressor that floats to the top. It's a best guess until you really start putting some personal, experiential mileage on the equipment and make your own decisions about what works and what doesn't work for you. I've used Paasche for years. Now I've used Iwatas for years. I had a couple of Badgers and could never get comfortable with them. But I have a lot of likes and dislikes about all of them and I've developed ways of working around or through those dislikes. What people say matter only to a certain point. What YOU get out of the equipment is the only thing that matters, ultimately and that means putting in the time using it.

Kylwell · Post by **Kylwell** » Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:44 pm

The one thing I can recommend is don't get a cheap airbrush or compressor. By cheap I mean those $20 Harbor Freight deals. If you end up spending more time cleaning than painting then you're going to hate it and eventually stop using it.

Styrofoam_Guy · Post by **Styrofoam_Guy** » Sat Aug 10, 2013 4:04 pm

I would equate buying an airbrush to trying to buy a car by looking at photos and without test driving it. There are opinions all over the place and such a variety of prices.

You get the car and then discover so many things about it. Some things you get used to while others bug the hell out of you.

My first airbrush was a pain to use and clean. I also had to learn everything from magazines (no internet back then). It probably went in and out of the box with little use for over 10 years.

I then got a different airbrush and it was light night and day. Easy to use, quick to clean up and great results.

Whereas before I dreaded taking the airbrush out the newer one I have no problem pulling it out to airbrush one little thing.

Kylwell · Post by **Kylwell** » Sat Aug 10, 2013 4:18 pm

Drive over to Loveland, CO next week. It's IPMS Nationals and there will be 2 airbrush dealers there, Grex & Iwata. Both usually are set up to let you test drive the brushes and give advice.

mightymax · Post by **mightymax** » Sat Aug 10, 2013 10:02 pm

Get a Paasche H set and end it! I got my dad to buy an H when I was in High school 35 years ago! I still use the same one!

Along the way I have acquired Badgers, Thayers, Aztecs, both single and fancy double action brushes.

My Paasche H was good then and still gets the job done! It is easy to clean. Easy to tear down if needed and parts are cheap and plentiful...

Face it folks. An airbrush is only as good as the person using it! We are painting models, not doing photo touchup or illustration artwork.

But get one you will be comfortable with

Max Bryant

Kylwell · Post by **Kylwell** » Sat Aug 10, 2013 10:05 pm

Yes but unless you push yourself you'll never get beyond that H. The last airbrush I bought, I bought because I was running up against the limits of the airbrush. Needed something finer and gravity fed.

But then again I started @ 17 with a Thayer & Chandler illustration brush.

Liquid Electron · Post by **Liquid Electron** » Sat Aug 10, 2013 10:18 pm

I'll get one soon, appreciate all the advice. Soon being relative to budget, of course.

mightymax · Post by **mightymax** » Sat Aug 10, 2013 10:28 pm

Kylwell wrote:Yes but unless you push yourself you'll never get beyond that H. The last airbrush I bought, I bought because I was running up against the limits of the airbrush. Needed something finer and gravity fed.

But then again I started @ 17 with a Thayer & Chandler illustration brush.

Like I said I have a bunch of other brushes. My wife says I have an airbrush collection! Push myself to get beyond the H? I can use other brushes but in the grand scheme of model building. The H will do what I need done. From broad coverage to fine lines to German mottle. Oh and did I say it was easy to clean and parts replacement cheap and easy.
Yeah I did.

I don't pass judgement on anyone recommending an Iwata, Harder Steenbeck or any Uber brush. Just that I feel for what we need an airbrush for. Sometimes simple, cheap, and easy to use and maintain plus practically indestructible should not just be discarded out of hand cause it is an old design and not the flavor of the month.

I don't have an I-phone either but I hear I can make phone calls on one!

Cheers
Max Bryant

Liquid Electron · Post by **Liquid Electron** » Mon Aug 12, 2013 11:13 pm

My suddenly very generous dad got overexcited at my photo of a lit-up warp nacelle and bought me a Paasche H set, with a very nice compressor which will make for buying a new brush later on a breeze. I'll see how it works, and practice, and learn.

Thanks for all the advice. (The kicker is I never really mentioned it except for I said to him once that I was not a fan of spray cans. Suddenly this.)