1701 Paint colors... again.

[Ramsayman]

I know I've seen threads on here before regarding the Smithsonian color palette for the TOS Enterprise colors. But I can't find it anywhere!

So, has anyone found model paint colors that are a close match to the Smithsonian colors? Or am I going to have to get paint chips from the paint store and try to mix colors?

[SpaceRanger1]

See here for a very thorough discussion:

http://scifimodelaction.com/sfmaforum/i ... pic=6508.0

And here for the original Air & Space Museum article;

https://airandspace.si.edu/stories/edit ... enterprise

[Ramsayman]

See here for a very thorough discussion:

http://scifimodelaction.com/sfmaforum/i ... pic=6508.0

And here for the original Air & Space Museum article;

https://airandspace.si.edu/stories/edit ... enterprise

Sheesh! Lots of discussion on that, eh? Thanks!

[starseeker]

Back when Hobbytalk was still... well, it still exists but only in a kind of terminal coma - Gary Kerr had a thread where he was providing a lot of information on the colors of the E. This was the thread:
http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/99-scienc ... e-138.html
and I just had a look to see if Gary had posted anything new there. Apparently not for a really long time. At one point he had sent a gaggle of slaves forth to try to match actual paint chips to available model paint mixtures. Where that project stands, I have no idea, but if anyone can do it, it wall be Gary. So do a Google search every couple months for TOS E colors and Gary's name and maybe something will turn up? Fingers crossed.

As for the color images and suggestions on those other threads: while an interesting project for the author, the images are of no use to the modeller unless everyone knows exactly what the color calibratiuons of everyone's computers/software/monitors/printers is and all use the same. And those paint mixtures are useless, too, unless you know exactly what "red" you need 4 drops of, etc.

And even if you know exactly what the colors were, what if you think they look "weird" on the model. Often the actual studio colors, balanced for studio lights and film, look way different to what they look like on-screen. I'd say, find your favorite images of the E and paint it to what you think it should look like. If some know-it-all gives you grief, just poke him or her in the eye with a pointy stick.

[Ramsayman]

Back when Hobbytalk was still... well, it still exists but only in a kind of terminal coma - Gary Kerr had a thread where he was providing a lot of information on the colors of the E. This was the thread:
http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/99-scienc ... e-138.html
and I just had a look to see if Gary had posted anything new there. Apparently not for a really long time. At one point he had sent a gaggle of slaves forth to try to match actual paint chips to available model paint mixtures. Where that project stands, I have no idea, but if anyone can do it, it wall be Gary. So do a Google search every couple months for TOS E colors and Gary's name and maybe something will turn up? Fingers crossed.

I'm pretty sure that's what I was looking for in the first place and wondered if there was anything more....

As for the color images and suggestions on those other threads: while an interesting project for the author, the images are of no use to the modeller unless everyone knows exactly what the color calibratiuons of everyone's computers/software/monitors/printers is and all use the same. And those paint mixtures are useless, too, unless you know exactly what "red" you need 4 drops of, etc.

EXACTLY!

And even if you know exactly what the colors were, what if you think they look "weird" on the model. Often the actual studio colors, balanced for studio lights and film, look way different to what they look like on-screen. I'd say, find your favorite images of the E and paint it to what you think it should look like. If some know-it-all gives you grief, just poke him or her in the eye with a pointy stick.

That's what I've been doing, but I just wanted to do one "right" as it were! I think I'll find the Smithsonian suggested paint swatches, then go to my local model shop. The guy there is REALLY good at finding colors - he used to touch up photographs by hand back in the day. He could likely give me some great advice on mixing the colors and whatnot.

[Zubie]

There was a big detailed thread here, but it sat in the STsig and so wasn't saved. I did save my old reply at papermodelers'
http://www.papermodelers.com/forum/alte ... prise.html

Sorry about not reading this thread earlier. It turns out that at starship modeler this question also came up. The posting of the LAB values created many similar questions and I posted an answer that may allow for better cross referencing; please pardon the long quote but tablet typing is a bit of a hassle [this is still true] also orig thread is limited to members.

Originally Posted by Zubie at starshipmodeler.net

Well the [NASM] article was informative but confusing. I suppose mainly because it uses L.A.B. references as opposed to FS or other paint ref guide. It's nice that lab is non proprietary, and its a standard based on what it looks like as opposed to how it photographs or appears on monitors or print, but it is still a ways to go for a paint ref to model (as a gallon of latex is not an option for your PL kit).

I suppose you could go to you local paint shop and pick up paint chips for valspar and such. I did find an rgb generator for lab color space
EasyRGB - The inimitable RGB and COLOR search engine!
Select CIE-L*ab as the color space and enter the 3 values from the article ( 1, 2, 3)

This will show the color on your monitor, but unfortunately that's just what it looks like on your monitor!

So to get an fs number I then went to http://encycolorpedia.com where you can search for the color using the hex rgb value. Note, this not quite right as the dec rgb is higher precision than the hex ref, but color is iffy and gray more so.

Ex. Prod hull lab 64, -3.53, 2.14,
Yields rgb of 150.11, 156.87, 151.15, in hexadecimal approx 96, 9d, 97
At http://encycolorpedia.com enter search for 969d97 and the answer pops out.
http://encycolorpedia.com/969d97

Note as you go down the lengthy set of reference details you will hit not only FS numbers , but also model master, vallejo, humbrol, testors, and tamiya colors with respective error rating (/\E)

Hope this helps.
Now if NASM could have clearly indicated where these shades were applied exactly (remembering the question regarding pilot neck color with respect to hull colors)

Ps. Edit. EasyRGB incorrectly rounded 156.87 to 156, i.e. #9c. 157 is #9d so values and search values changed. It makes it a tad greener, but doesn't radically change the recommended paint values.

Note-this site also has pantone-pms ref
http://encycolorpedia.com/969d97#pantone_pms
Curiously, most modelers have preferred a lighter shade than that found, and considerably more neutral, tamiya's xf12 slightly whitened. Xf12 has a lightness rating of 75% vs the NASM recommended @ 60%.

In hindsight I'm not entirely surprised. I recall the first time I painted a b-24 light gray by FS ref I thought that was too dark. Same for spifires in official sky, both too dark and too green. I think in my mind the colors were closer to airfix and revell artwork than what a researcher said. Those old AMT box cover Enterprises are nearly white.
__________________
La maquina sobre mi escritorio es una "computadora" del latin "computare", no un "ordenador". El estado de mi escritorio afirma eso. (yo)
http://constantvariation.blogspot.com/

I had to do some editing to get the post to format correctly so hopefully the links are ok.